if this is up right, the upgrade is working. Working for you, anyway, it’s all messed up on this side of the interface. Need to refresh or something.
Forgot to include this morning:
– During an online audio interview Juvi said X-Pac had recently tried to commit suicide. PWTorch quotes Sean Waltman (scroll down to Monday’s entry) saying he accidentally mixed anti-depressants and alcohol. Either way, WWE extended an offer to pay for rehab for any of it’s ex-wrestlers, and X-Pac’s taking them up on it right now. I wouldn’t expect to see him on upcoming tapings.
– Updated card on CMLL.com
CMLL (FRI) 02/15 Arena Mexico
1) Astro Boy & Metálico vs Pólvora & Vaquero
2) Bam Bam, Pequeño Olímpico, Último Dragoncito vs Pequeño Black Warrior, Pequeño Violencia, Pierrothito
3) Heavy Metal, Máximo, Sagrado vs Misterioso II, Shigeo Okumura, Virus
4) Alex Koslov, Grey Shadow, Marco Corelone vs Damián 666, Héctor Garza, Terrible
5) Místico, Sombra, Volador Jr. vs Averno, el Hijo del Perro Aguayo, Mephisto
Sombra and Grey Shadow swapped spots. Shadow got demoted. There’s no explanation given by CMLL, though I guess we’ve now got a Foreign Tecnico trio.
I dunno it really matters for finishes, because the semimain looks like it’s just the Perros turning on Hector again, and Garza figures on determining the main event too.
– This isn’t really news, but I notice it comes up in the RSS feeds I check every morning: David Brashear at Inside Pulse sure appears to be just rewording my stuff for his own use. I can usually tell when people do this sort of stuff (though rarely with me), because they report the also report the same errors I report.
I’m pretty sure I’m supposed to be upset about this, and I’m not for some reason. I think it’s because I feel like much of what I’m doing is also just rewording stuff written elsewhere (it takes more work when it’s another language.) And I think lucha needs more coverage, and if I can’t be bothered to do it, someone else might as well do it for me, using me.
The thing is, his report is completely without links – both to me, and to the people I’m linking to who actually wrote the original stuff. Without links, the way David Brashear is writing it currently, it’s plagiarism. This isn’t the crime of the century, but it’s still not the way to go about things, and I hope this message is enough to change things.
As far as ‘mainstream wrestling’ articles that continually pop up in my lucha RSS feeds, the far more annoying one is 411Mania’s weekly Buy or Sell article. Google news pulls it because “BUY or SELL focuses on topics like the U.S. Independent scene, Lucha Libre, Japanese Wrestling and pretty much anything else that isn’t mainstream wrestling,” is included in every edition. That’s actually a neat concept, but the reality is ROH, ROH, ROH, a bit more ROH, other people trying to do their own versions of ROH, more ROH, and occasionally some NOAH or DG when there’s some ROH crossover. Slight exaggeration, but I’m pretty sure there’s not been any lucha libre.
Maybe they should take lucha libre out of their boilerplate until they’re ready to Buy or Sell “AAA really has a plan for this Rey de Reyes tournament.” If only there was some sort of ROH/CMLL connection.
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please let this work
by the way, there’s an option to turn on what amounts to avatars, but there’s no way I’m ever turning it on. DOWN WITH GRAPHICS.
As a current (I think) writer for 411, there was one Buy or Sell where a lucha question was used. It was something simple (I guess that’s the word) like “Will Santo return to CMLL/Arena Mexico sometime in 2008”.
I wanted to ask “Is the Apache Family Saga the best angle going on in all of wrestling”, but no one follows AAA over there except for me.
PS: Please don’t hold my (past or present) affiliation with them against me
Yes, the Apache saga is pretty fun to follow. Don’t you think Tiffany should’ve asked Billy and Faby to be the Godparents of her child? Faby may be the only female in wrestling who can sell tickets.
Tiffany should claim that Billy is her baby’s father to keep the angle going, but it might be going to far for a storyline, I wouldn’t be surprised that female fans had attacked Tiffany in real life since many take the angles as if they’re true.
Tiffany just needs to show up again, so there are more than six women healthy.
I wonder if they’ve quietly canceled Reina de Reinas. There’s been no talk about it lately.
2/23 would be a good time as ever for that…
I love seeing everything I do word for word on many sites around the world. From the UK, US, Germany, and even Mexico I’ve seen stuff I have typed verbatim and my name was never on it. Sure me and Cubs get stuff from other people but at least we give credit. What do you expect though it does not good to get mad it’s just the way of the internet.
It might be a good thing if Reina de Reinas was cancelled so we don’t have to see Martha Villalobos and her horrible group around this time of the year.
Speaking of tournaments – anyone thinking CMLL will run the Reyes Del Aire next Friday? Last version was one year ago if you don’t count the Arena Coliseo one in August (which I don’t).
You would think that if Reina is not going to be a TV tapings this year, that the AAA office would at least sell it as a non-televised house show to pop a gate. Mari should win it just to continue her push.
Speaking of tournaments – anyone thinking CMLL will run the Reyes Del Aire next Friday?
That seems like something they would announce at least two weeks in advance, rather than just a week as usual. Not that the RdA is a “big show” thing for CMLL, but I would think that would run on a week with a big 1-on-1 or parejas match in the main…
I’d love to see Averno/Mephisto or the GDI do a couple of ROH dates. Not holding my breathe, but it could be awesome.
~rl
lucha, no Fabi is not the only female in wrestling that can sell tickets, as there are many all female promotions that Fabi Apache doesnt compete in that sell out the venue they’re in quite often.
on another note, cubs there is, or at least was a ROH/CMLL connection, Rocky Romero (Black Tiger IV).
Yes. He’s probably Grey Shadow. That was the joke. I try to be funny occasionally. You should consider it.
Rocky Romero cant be Grey Shadow as a few of the dates that Grey Shadow has wrestled, Rocky Romero wrestled on the same day in another country.
Do you have specific examples? ROH hasn’t run all month (till next Friday), and I haven’t seen him on any PWG or elsewhere.
Faby is the only female in both Mexico and the US whose name on the card means tickets sold. She is a real draw. I was worried about her weight, but she seems to have it under control.
What female promotions in North America sellout?
Chui,
I like the Billy Boy is the daddy gimmick. I was also thinking Tiffany couldn’ve said that she just does not know who the father is, and subpeonas half the AAA roster for a paternity test. Billy would get a subpeona, but so would Ciber, Pimpi, and others.
SHIMMER sells out every one of their tapings. (on another note, do you go to the tapings cubs? they tape outside of Chicago in Berwyn)
also, Lacey’s name on a card mean tickets sold. she’s the not the best wrestler, she’s decent though, but she is immensely popular. it’s funny too because she is a heel (rudo).
I’ve gone to one. I may go to another, by the do sell out before the show and I never buy tickets before the show. (I just got an e-mail this morning telling me they were down to 14! for the taping next month.)
If I was a savvier person, I’d talk my way into a free ticket. I really should know how to do that by now, I’ve paid for enough indy wrestling. I could be jtron’s gofer or something.
On the other hand, they’ve got to pack in folding chairs to get to 150 people. (Not that much more than LLF does at times, I bet.) It’s a very small building, and I’m pretty sure a card featuring Fabi Apache could fill a greater building. Probably HAS drawn a greater amount.
Lacey, and other SHIMMER-ese wrestlers are great, but they’re only known by intense wrestling fans mostly in the US. Fabi Apache is on national television every week on a very visible network, seen by far more part (more than who see TNA, so I wouldn’t consider Rain or Kong either.) The other women aren’t in the same stratosphere as Fabi.
Fabi is a draw. A household name in the Hispanic community. Each airing of AAA on Galavision does over 150,000 viewers in the A 18-49 demo in the US. In Mexico she’s on a tv show that is seen in about 5%-7% of Mexico’s 25,000,000 households.
Lacey?
“Rocky Romero cant be Grey Shadow as a few of the dates that Grey Shadow has wrestled, Rocky Romero wrestled on the same day in another country.”
As cubs asked, tell us which shows and matches he worked.
I vote this guy not be allowed to stay around unless he proves the above statement.
i’m still backtracking, i’m backed up at work right now. i’ll post it when i find it, i remember reading he was supposed to work a show when Grey Shadow was wrestling.
and Rob, how about you vote to keep your racist comments to yourself. thanks.
You remember wrong. But you’re just a fountain of misinformation. Feel free to fail a prove another point of yours though. This oughta be more fun than the other day when you claimed Ultimo Dragon was the first to do the asai moonsault.
Holy crap… jlavaia = torgaman?
Rob isn’t racist… he’s Canadian.
What racist comments did Rob make?
I think jlavaia is LUCHAGOYLE. Just kidding.
We Canadians love everyone except people from Ottawa and Montreal.
And Rocky Romero.
I’ll admit I kinda zoned off on yesterday’s comment thread because “top 10 wrestlers of all time” lists without El Santo and lines like “popularized by the Briscos” things do that to me. But then you’re now referring to Robert as a racist and I figured I must’ve missed something.
This is what I missed!
>it shows that you are >immature and ignorant, and
>due to those things i’m also
>assuming you’re a racist.
>dont type out insults on this
>great site
You’re calling Robert names, and then telling people not to call people names in the next sentence? (And it’s not like the insult makes any sense on it’s own either.)
I really need you to take it down quite a few notches from what you’re doing.
To help your out with proving Rocky is not Grey Shadow, here’s the dates he’s worked (as far as we know)
– 02/01
– 02/03
– 02/08
– 02/15
Next time you make this sort of statement, you’d be better off having the proof first, rather than the statement first and some vague idea about proving it later.
Romero last worked for PWG on 1/27 and his next date I know for sure is for ROH next weekend and the fact that Grey Shadow looks a helluva lot like Romero in the face helps that argument.
If you prove him wrong it takes away from the fun when he has to admit he was talking out of his ass.
Well, am going to ask Dave Marquez about Romero/Gray Shadow. He should know something.
“This oughta be more fun than the other day when you claimed Ultimo Dragon was the first to do the asai moonsault.”
dude, Ultimo Dragon is Yoshihiro Asai. the move was named after him. he did it first.
“how about you vote to keep your racist comments to yourself”
what racist comments did he make jlavaia? and also luchawiki clearly shows picture proof that Romero is Shadow.
Ultimo POPULARIZED the move. Atlantis had been doing it since at least 1987. There is video footage clearly showing this and photos in magazines of Atlantis doing what looks to be the asai moonsault back in 1984 but without video footage I don’t want to go that far and claim he was doing in ’84.
Another day and our buddy still hasn’t backed up the Romero isn’t Shadow statement. Admitting you were wrong is very manly.
i was wrong about Grey Shadow. it happens.
on another note, Bruce is correct Rob, Ultimo
Dragon innovated the move. he first did it in 1987 when he debuted under his real name. he didnt name the move, it was named after him. Atlantis hits alot more Quebradas than Asai Moonsaults. see, Asai Moonsaults are springboard moonsaults onto a standing opponent on the outside of the ring. a Quebrada is a springboard moonsault onto a standing opponent inside the ring. alittle bit of a difference. and if you need video proof, look up Ultimo’s first match as he did one in the match. it was a tag match in japan, he teamed with Naoki Sano and someone else, and i forget who they faced, it was in May of 87.
Did Ultimo even wrestle in Japan in 1987? Don’t say “yes”, give me a date/name of opponent/promotion and a link to the video if you have it. Otherwise tell me where you got the show on tape from since I’m assuming you’ve seen something you are claiming happened.
(BTW, I noticed you said May of 1987. Ultimo was in Mexico that month making his debut there and did not leave for Japan till the following year.)
Go ahead, prove yourself for once. I dare you.
Once again you’re talking out of your ass and it’s incredibly annoying. Don’t patronize me by explaining what an asai moonsault is and what a quebrada is, I’m well aware. Atlantis did the ASAI MOONSAULT… i.e. a springboard moonsault off the second rope to the floor on a standing opponent (*deep breath*) in 1987. In fact, a smart man would bet Ultimo saw Atlantis doing the move while he was training in Mexico and used it as his own. Surely Atlantis wouldn’t need to steal it from Ultimo since he was doing it in the early 80’s.
Oh, and I apologize in advance for any non-existent racial remarks I may have made above.
this time i have the proof, as i’m a big Ultimo Dragon fan and i have alot of his matches.
his debut match i dont have, but it’s listed almost everywhere as this:
Asai/Naoki Sano/Hirokazu Hata vs. Los Millonarios de la Muerte on 5/13/87 from Arena Aficion.
matches i have include:
– Asai/Naoki Sano/Hirokazu Hata vs. Kendo Star/Kung Fu/Kato Kung Lee from the UWA vs. EMLL Gran Guerra 80s vol.1 VHS.
– Asai/Sano/Hata vs. Black Terry/Jose Luis Feliciano/Shu El Guerrero for the Distrito Federal Trios Titles, this took place on 8/26/87 at Arena Naucalpan. this i have on an old best of Dragon in Mexico VHS. the best of in mexico DVD i have doesnt have his early stuff, or i would load it to my computer and send it to you.
also i kind of doubt that he saw Atlantis do the move and then decided to start using it. if Atlantis was the first to do the move, then why was it not named for him. Atlantis was wrestling way before Dragon and was well known before Ultimo was, so if the move was innovated by Atlantis it would be named for Atlantis (or most likely named by Atlantis). Atlantis has innovated moves such as La Atlantida. they also wrestled for completely different promotions. Ultimo Dragon for UWA, Atlantis for CMLL (EMLL).
there’s your proof. enjoy.
Hold on a sec… you said:
“Ultimo Dragon innovated the move. he first did it in 1987 when he debuted under his real name.”
Then you said:
“his debut match i dont have”
You have to pick a story and stick to it my friend.
Anyways, *none* of those matches have asai moonsaults in them b/c Dragon didn’t begin using that for a couple of years. You were supposed to prove he used the asai moonsault in 1987 as you claimed in a previous post. I’m feeling generous so I’ll give you another chance before calling you names.
The reason Atlantis isn’t known for innovating the move is b/c VERY LITTLE footage exists of Mexico in the early 80’s and by the time the tape trading community started up, Asai was the big craze with Hamada’s UWF taking off and Meltzer spreading the word through his newsletter about the move he saw live on his first Japan trip.
But thanks for telling me Atlantis and Ultimo worked for seperate companies. I HAD NO IDEA. REALLY. YOU ARE SO SMART. I AM SUCH A NEWBIE.
If anyone from the Torreon area was reading this, they’d take issue with both of us since Stuka was doing the move in the early 80’s as well according to many sources and photos.
just because i dont have the match, doesnt mean he didnt do the move in the match. in the 2 matches that i listed that i do have, he does do the move. you stated Atlantis did it in 1987. let’s see your proof, that he did it first. as i have clearly shown 3 matches in which Ultimo Dragon performs the move in 1987. you have yet to list one match from that year that Atlantis performs an Asai Moonsault and not a Quebrada, and the match would have to take place before 5/13/87 to prove that you are correct.
“just because i dont have the match, doesnt mean he didnt do the move in the match.”
Okay, clearly you’re a ‘tard. That’s not a racist term, that just means you’re plain and simple – retarded.
How can you prove he did something you’ve never seen?
Hey, Hulk Hogan did the asai moonsault in 1981 during an AWA squash match. I don’t have video of it. I just know he had a match on January 14th of that year and I’m assuming he did it. You can’t prove me wrong b/c the match doesn’t exist on tape.
So see, we both lose. Hulk Hogan wins as usual.
“as i have clearly shown 3 matches in which Ultimo Dragon performs the move in 1987”
BTW, I don’t know your definition of “clearly shown” but I told you – I have those matches and Ultimo doesn’t do an asai moonsault in any of them much the same way Juventud Guerrera doesn’t do a somersault plancha into a huracanrana in ECW as you claimed the other day.
The fact you’re making shit up so randomly clearly makes me think I’m arguing with a 14 year old which kinda sucks.
i saw clips of his debut match you scumbag. you’ve yet to state any match from 1987 in which Atlantis does the move. since you clearly dont know of any matches in which he does and cant show any evidence to prove i’m wrong, then clearly you’re the “tard”. grow the **** up little girl and stop trying to put me down due to your own inadaquateness. you talk all tough and run your mouth over the computer which clearly shows your age kid. stop sending me posts and wasting my time. you clearly dont know anything about wrestling and the moves. chump.
“Ultimo
Dragon innovated the move. he first did it in 1987 when he debuted under his real name.”
Still waiting for proof.
I clearly do know nothing about wrestling though. I’ll go undo every change I ever made to the Wiki right after I finish typing this.
already posted the proof. maybe you should read alittle slower and you’d see it. i’m waiting for you to prove that Atlantis did the move first. you still havent proven that Atlantis did it before Ultimo Dragon did.
also anybody can post anything to Wikipedia, hence why it’s so wrong and not a credible site at all.
Anyone else see any proof? Anyone at all? Didn’t think so.
Oooooohhhhh – insulting the Wiki, way to get over on this site. First the scatching promo and then insulting the best Lucha site on the net. You play a rudo in your backyard fed in Durham?
BTW, he’s 23. How a 23 year-old was around to regularly watch Sammartino, Graham and Inoki wrestle is quite amazing.
wow, so you really have no life and too much time on your hands to go and look me up. i’m flattered. but sorry guy, i’m married. and once again i have to go over with you the inventions of VCR, DVD player, and Camera. that’s how i can watch matches. you keep running your mouth like pussy. you know where i am. Bull City. you must’ve had a reason for looking me up. come pay me a visit ha. i bet you wont run your mouth then little kid. tell your skank mother she needs to beat some manners into you. little children like yourself need to be banned from computer use. i also believe it’s past your bedtime. damn your parents really didnt raise you right. what happened? your mother too busy whoring around, so she couldnt take care of her kid. the fact that want to be me, by looking me up shows that you’re up to something, like really trying to be me. i have a big problem with this. keep running your mouth pussy and not backing it up. you’re one of those internet tough guy wanna bes.
the fact remains, since you cant prove your statement of “Atlantis did an Asai Moonsault before Ultimo Dragon” correct, you decided to run your bitch mouth and post my personal info on a public site, and show how soft you really are. keep playing these little kid games and pray i dont find out your info you little f*ck. piece of sh*t.
Are you sure Storm Shadow didn’t invent the asai moonsault?
what?
i am new to this site, so i don’t know if this is what normally goes on, but i think the both of you definitely crossed the line.